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  1. #26
    Info Conteúdo e Citações Jogos Mensageiros
    Jan 2001

    Originalmente enviada por mrcapone
    vcs pra mim tão NO MUNDO DA LUA, eu ainda custo a acreditar que algum brasuka teve comparecimento em todos estes jogos. Realmente, eu nao acredito.
    Cara, com todo respeito, mas o que você espera que a gente te responda, sendo ignorante dessa forma?

    Eu trabalho no laboratório que criou o Lua. Uso a linguagem há anos e desenvolvi vários projetos com ela. Os criadores da linguagem foram meus professores. Eu participo de listas de discussão da linguagem e vejo ela aparecendo na mídia (sites de jogos) o tempo todo.

    Lua é uma das linguagens scripts mais utilizadas no mundo dos jogos, está deixando Python pra trás... comendo poeira.

    Pra sua informação, Lua é AMPLAMENTE utilizada na Microsoft Game Studios. Alguns EMPREGADOS DA MICROSOFT fizeram um roundtable em uma conferência para desenvolvedores de jogos que teve este mês de Abril nos EUA (Game Developers Conference 2004).

    Vou postar uma cópia do artigo que eles escreveram numa próxima mensagem, mas fique sabendo que o Brasil só não tá lá no topo dos paises mais avançados tecnologicamente pq não temos dinheiro. Os pesquisadores brasileiros são MUITO bons, e nós exportamos muita tecnologia. Eu posso dizer, eu sou pesquisador.

  2. # Publicidade

  3. #27
    Info Conteúdo e Citações Jogos Mensageiros
    Jan 2001

    GDC 2004 - Lua in the Gaming Industry Roundtable Report
       Jon Burns [1]
       David Eichorn [2]
       Microsoft Game Studios
       The embedded programming language Lua is becoming more and more widely
       used  in  the  gaming  industry. The beauty of this language is in its
       simplicity  and  flexibility;  several  games  within  Microsoft  Game
       Studios employ the use of Lua for many aspects of their architectures,
       including  scripting,  game  balancing,  AI  decision  making, driving
       animations,  UI  layout,  and  level  building.  The  purpose  of this
       roundtable  discussion  is  to  bring  developers  from  the  industry
       together to share in their experiences integrating Lua into their game
       projects.  The goal is to spread awareness of the most popular uses of
       Lua  and  to also make any short-comings or pitfalls apparent to those
       developers evaluating the use of Lua in their games.
       The  first  session  had approximately sixty attendants, primarily all
       developers.   The   second   session   had  approximately  forty  five
       attendants,  again,  primarily  all  developers. The first session had
       many  more active participants, approximately fifteen, as more of this
       group had some good experience working with Lua on their projects. The
       second   group   was   less   experienced;  only  approximately  seven
       participated  actively.  Some attended to share their experience while
       others  simply wanted to learn more about Lua's impact in the industry
       or evaluate it for possible use.
    Key Discussion Points
      Lua vs. Python
       The  comparison  of Lua and Python was a major theme of both sessions.
       The  general  consensus  here  is  that  Lua is much faster, uses less
       memory,  has  a smaller footprint, and is easier to get up and running
       and  hooked  into  a  game  than Python. Python, however, is much more
       scalable  than  Lua.  Python has a good set of modules for specialized
       tasks  which  makes  it  a  good  language  to  use for cross-platform
       development, while in Lua you'd have to write much of it yourself.
       Many  developers  use  both  languages for different purposes - Lua is
       most  often  used for small-scale while Python is used for large-scale
       tasks  (such  as tool development efforts). Lua is often used for game
       scripting,  Python  for  tools. One developer even said he had written
       his Lua debugger in Python!
      Lua vs. XML
       A  question  was posed regarding using Lua or XML for data definition.
       The  general  consensus was that Lua is much more compact and readable
       than  XML.  XML  is  good  for  describing  small  sets  of  data  and
       web-related  data, and it was suggested that a team could use XML as a
       meta-language  to express game data in binary, which would be good for
       cross-platform  development.  Most  agreed  it  is much easier to find
       XML-savvy editors than Lua editors.
      Lua's easy ramp-up time
       Most  developers  heavily  experienced with Lua said Lua is a language
       that developers can learn in about 10 minutes and that non-programmers
       can  pick  up  at  a fairly quick pace. Certain scripting applications
       using  Lua  could be a good way for junior programmers to get into the
       There  is  good  documentation  for  Lua,  which  aids  in the ramp-up
       process. There is now a Lua Programming book, reference manuals, and a
       good community support web site [3] [4].
      Non-programmers using Lua
       There  was  general  agreement  that  non-programmers - game and level
       designers, perhaps artists - can learn to understand the syntax of the
       language and write small bits of code with excellent results, but that
       learning  how to actually program in Lua is a challenge. The risk here
       is  the higher chance of subtle bugs being introduced into Lua scripts
       from these non-technical people.
       For  example,  some  devs  had problems with their artists not knowing
       good  naming  conventions and programming concepts well enough to do a
       good job in Lua. One suggestion was to use a tool named Ultraedit that
       color-codes  the Lua script - this developer claimed his artists found
       programming in Lua much easier in this editing program.
       It was also suggested that data-driven design support in Lua is better
       for  these  non-technical  people.  One developer suggested creating a
       multi-tiered system that added increasing levels of abstraction - each
       level  increasing  the  ease of use for the non-technical people using
       Lua. He claimed it has worked very effectively in his project.
      Binding Lua to C++
       Many less-experienced Lua users asked about binding Lua with C++. Some
       developers   are   using  the  Luabind  tool  which  does  this  quite
       effectively,  though  some  cautioned  that the compile times are much
       longer.  One  mentioned that the tool ToLua is no longer supported, so
       use  of  it  should  be  transitioned  to  another  automatic  binding
       generation tool. Other tools mentioned included LuaPlus and Swig. Some
       developers  found  it easier to write their own in-house tools to bind
       Lua and C++ because it is quite easy to do.
       The  discussion  produced  this word of caution: the easier it gets to
       bind  Lua to data objects in the game source, the easier it is to fall
       into the trap of binding *everything* to Lua, which is dangerous...
      Issues encountered when using Lua in game development
       The attendees had many suggestions on avoiding pitfalls:
       Avoid  using  Lua  in  "every  frame"  actions  as  performance  drops
       dramatically.  For example, don't use Lua to do animation updates; set
       up  parameters  for  the  animation in Lua and do the updates in C/C++
       Avoid  using  Lua  for large game development tasks; rather use Lua in
       quick small-scale actions.
       Avoid  using extremely large table sizes as performance drops in table
       access actions.
       Store  state information outside of Lua in C++ objects, only bind when
       Be  careful about what data is bound to Lua. Having careful control of
       this  data can result in a good, stable environment regarding security
       Call garbage-collection routines explicitly only when free cycles come
       up.  Some  devs  found  that  Lua  was  doing  garbage  collection  at
       inopportune times.
       One  developer  cautioned against using incremental garbage collection
       as he observed noticeable slowdown. Because it is a new functionality,
       however, this claim wasn't discussed much.
      Good things about Lua
       The  attendees  had  the  following  to say about what appeals to them
       about using Lua:
       Lua  coroutines work "reasonably well" for cooperative multithreading.
       One  developer  said  they have about twice the overhead of a function
       call (negligible), and that having 3-4 works just fine.
       All of the developers love the fact that licensing Lua is so easy, and
       especially so free.
       In  event-based  and  polling  systems, many of the developers claimed
       they observe no noticeable bottlenecks caused by Lua.
       New  features/tools  coming into the Lua scene make it more attractive
       day by day: Lualint and the new standard debugging library provided in
       Lua 5.0.
       All devs unanimously agreed that the support for Lua is great, whether
       off of the Lua homepage or the community sites, etc.
      Experiences applying Lua
       The  group  shared  some  of  their own personal uses of Lua that were
       particularly memorable and successful:
       One  developer  created  a  cutscene  handler  in Lua that managed the
       triggering  of  cutscenes  in  his  game  project. He found it easy to
       manage in Lua.
       One  developer  was  able to setup a record / replay system for all UI
       One developer was doing unit code testing in Lua.
       One  developer  was  able  to  derive  game objects in Lua, and assign
       functions  to  these  objects  in order to test their attributes, etc.
       more easily.
       One  developer  integrated Lua with their physics engine to allow more
       accessibility to tweak physics scripts dynamically.
    Summary and Conclusions
       This  roundtable  focused  on the hands-on experiences of people using
       Lua  in  the gaming industry. Attendees were encouraged to share their
       personal  experiences  with  Lua  in  order to spread awareness of the
       benefits  and  pitfalls  of  this  embedded language. The two sessions
       accomplished  this goal quite successfully (we as moderators were very
       surprised  at  the interest in Lua in the gaming industry based on the
       number of attendees both days and in the discussion that came about) -
       there  was good conversation in both roundtable sessions that conveyed
       several  things,  most  notably:  1)  The diverse uses of Lua that are
       specific  to  games  development,  2) What not to use Lua for in games
       development,  3)  The  ease  of  ramp up time for users of Lua, and 4)
       Comparisons  against  other  languages and even older releases of Lua.
       This is where most interest lay for both days.
       There  are  definitely  a handful of very experienced Lua users in the
       gaming  industry  that  are  doing  some very impressive work in their
       projects with the language. Future roundtables on this topic can begin
       to  explore more of what the industry would like to see as features of
       the   language   itself  and  how  the  community  support  for  games
       development can expand more effectively...

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